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Jim talks with cognitive scientist and AI researcher Joscha Bach about the computational and representational foundations of consciousness, mind, and reality. They discuss the phenomenology of waking up and coalescing into a self, language as a representational architecture and natural language as “a genre of music,” the brain as a game engine constructing a simulated world, the “feeling of realness” as a hallucination, “to be real means to be implemented” as a criterion for reality, money as an AI and a mechanism for reward allocation, the need for multi-dimensional organizational signaling beyond money, the apparent reversibility of the universe as an emergent observational artifact, the block universe and its incompatibility with stacked emergence, causality as a model property and retrocausality at the level of agents, computation vs. the simulation hypothesis, the brain’s object engine and the perceptual choice to see textures vs. named objects, aphantasia and metacognition about perception, why only simulations can be conscious, Christof Koch’s shift from physicalism to panpsychism and the unreliability of revelatory mental states, consciousness as second-order perception distinct from selfhood, panpsychism’s resurgence and its failure to formalize “the consciousness of a particle,” consciousness as happening at neuronal communication speeds, intelligence vs. consciousness as relatively orthogonal dimensions, the Waymo as highly intelligent but not conscious, François Chollet’s argument that deploying skills is not itself intelligent, consciousness as a consensus algorithm analogous to blockchain, whether a bacterium or a cat needs a self-model to achieve coherence, emotion and motivation as core to cognition in MicroPsi, Karl Friston’s free energy principle and its limits at higher emergent levels, humans as “multicellular at the next level” forming transcendental agents, the global optimum of collectively enacted agency as “God” as the ultimate source of meaning, and much more.

• Episode Transcript
• California Institute for Machine Consciousness (CIMC)
• Principles of Synthetic Intelligence, by Joscha Bach
• JRS EP 72 – Joscha Bach on Minds, Machines & Magic
• JRS EP 87: Joscha Bach on Theories of Consciousness –
• JRS EP Currents 83: Joscha Bach on Synthetic Intelligence

Joscha Bach is a cognitive scientist and AI researcher, and the founder of the California Institute for Machine Consciousness. In the past, he researched and taught at Humboldt University of Berlin, the Institute of Cognitive Science in Osnabrück, MIT Media Lab, the Harvard Program for Evolutionary Dynamics and Intel Labs. He has helped build several startups and created the cognitive architecture MicroPsi, which studies the relationship between emotion, motivation and cognition. He currently lives in the Bay area in California.

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In this Worldviews episode, Jim talks with Iain McGilchrist about consciousness, matter, and the nature of reality. They discuss consciousness as the basis of everything we know, matter as a phase of consciousness that provides resistance and persistence, pan-experientialism and the belief that everything in the cosmos experiences in some form, the whirlpool metaphor for individual consciousness within a broader field, emergent naturalism and nested levels of organization, the question of whether the universe is continuous or granular at the Planck scale, consciousness in animals including chimps and corvids, language as the principal difference between human and animal consciousness, John Vervaeke’s distinction between propositional and participatory knowing, the divided brain and how the left and right hemispheres attend to the world differently, the left hemisphere’s focus on decontextualized abstractions versus the right hemisphere’s grasp of interconnected wholes, how the left hemisphere deals with representations while the right hemisphere experiences presences, living in a world dominated by the relatively stupid left hemisphere, the relationship between consciousness and reality as an encounter rather than naive realism or idealism, relations coming before things, Lee Smolin’s argument that time cannot be an illusion, assembly theory’s challenge to the block universe, values as ontological primitives that cannot be derived from a valueless cosmos, the distinction between value and values, teleology as a lure rather than determinism using Waddington’s creodes metaphor, the three elements of a fulfilled life (belonging to a coherent social group, belonging in nature, and belonging in the cosmos), the breakdown of collective sense making despite increased education levels, the decline in the caliber of political leaders, the distinction between information and wisdom, and much more.

• Episode Transcript
• The Master and His Emissary, by Iain McGilchrist
• The Matter with Things, by Iain McGilchrist
• JRS EP 154 – Iain McGilchrist on The Matter With Things
• JRS EP 155 Iain McGilchrist Part 2: The Matter With Things
• The Emergence of Everything, by Harold Morowitz
• Time Reborn, by Lee Smolin
• JRS EP 5 Lee Smolin – Quantum Foundations and Einstein’s Unfinished Revolution

Iain McGilchrist is a former Fellow of All Souls College, Oxford, an associate Fellow of Green Templeton College, Oxford, a Fellow of the Royal College of Psychiatrists, a Fellow of the Royal Society of Arts, a Consultant Emeritus of the Bethlem and Maudsley Hospital, London, a former research Fellow in Neuroimaging at Johns Hopkins University Medical School, Baltimore, and a former Fellow of the Institute of Advanced Studies in Stellenbosch. He now lives on the Isle of Skye, off the coast of North West Scotland, where he continues to write, and lectures worldwide. He is committed to the idea that the mind and brain can be understood only by seeing them in the broadest possible context, that of the whole of our physical and spiritual existence, and of the wider human culture in which they arise – the culture which helps to mould, and in turn is moulded by, our minds and brains.

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In a special edition of the new Worldviews series, Brendan Graham Dempsey asks Jim about his life and worldview using a faith development interview. They discuss Jim’s life chapters from growing up through becoming a complexity guy and GameB advocate, his age 11 epiphany that religion is bullshit after researching world religions at the library, the formative influence of his wife and parents who built lives from poverty, his realization that exponential growth on a finite planet driven by advertising and economic systems is destructive, understanding the limits of knowledge through complexity science and rejecting naive Newtonianism, his three core values of human well-being, ecological richness, and preserving humanity’s path to bring the universe to life, the belief that humans may be the only general intelligence in the universe, the sacred as high-dimensional experiences that can’t be explained scientifically, the importance of humility given how often we’re wrong, the decision-making method of studying enough for a bullshitter’s understanding then walking until reaching a conclusion, utilitarian deontology, human life as a leaf node on the tree of emergence, language and science as major transitions with AI as a potential third, disbelief in the supernatural, explaining evil through game theory, psychopathy as evil by nature, humans as mesoscale entities, a universe fine-tuned for emergence, and much more.

• Episode Transcript
• Institute of Applied Metatheory
• A God That Could be Real: Spirituality, Science, and the Future of Our Planet, by Nancy Ellen Abrams

Brendan Graham Dempsey is Director of Research at the Institute of Applied Metatheory, where he studies the complexification of worldviews and human meaning-making systems across scales. He holds an advanced degree from Yale University, where he studied religion and culture. His books include Emergentism: A Religion of Complexity for the Metamodern World and the multi-volume Evolution of Meaning series. He is Managing Editor of Integration: The Journal of Big Picture Theory and Practice and a founding editor of Metamodern Theory & Praxis.